Spirits in Hell
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Q: My human reasoning is saying that our Creator would not banish to "nothingness" anything He has created. Even ashes are a different form. And why would He allow Satan and his to continue forever in a prison, away from Him forever, and have a different "program" for the souls He has created who have rejected His Salvation in YaHshua.
Website Note: This question came in response to an article/study I did on Heaven and Hell -- In this article, and in a few other places, I mention the wicked are going to be destroyed for ever, becoming ashes beneath the feet of the righteous, whether literally or as and alogical statement and then I went on to say that the real "nothingness" will be realized by the wicked while those of the Spirit world that sinned will be put into a spiritual prison, forever separated from their Creator. Thank you for the questions and the opportunity to elaborate.
A: I see your point and the final answer to all of this will be revealed to us when the shadows of things to come are removed and we are with Him. Only then we all see the same answer and solution to some of these problems we discuss today. Much of what I know about this subject is speculation and my opinion, of course, but in dealing with this subject it is my purpose to stay within the word, not to jump off into the space of imaginations or of past teachings that are actually just that, the imaginations of men.
I see your reasoning and many others say this same thing but in a different way. For example, some say they would not have a god that is so cruel, especially one that would destroy so many people completely. Others, like many in the Eastern religions, have answered this question of why a god would destroy what he or she has created and the answer for this, in their religion, or religions is that all things continue on, even if it is destroyed. Recycling the spirits of all things. Where did they get this idea? Not from our Creator, for He tells us the wicked are not recycled. And actually, in the end, according to the Eastern thinking, when all have been reconciled to the greater being or Universal Intelligence everyone and everything is sucked up into this great void of nothingness -- this is seen as the pure future, the final answer.
Your question as to why He would treat one part of His creation better than another is a valid question. Perhaps part of the answer is found in another question: Why “salvation” for some and not for others? Some religions have answered this question by saying that all things continue on, some recycle back into other lives while others become flowers, or as you suggested, ashes. Certainly we are told that the wicked will become ashes beneath the feet of the righteous – Mal 4:1-3 -- and -- Revelation 21:1. -- we tend to think in physical terms but "ashes" of the wicked will be as nothing -- ash is "something" but
Using the same line of reasoning God would not create something to destroy it, we would have to answer, then, why were we made perishable while others were not. It appears His angels were created immortal, we were not. So, what about those immortal spirits that rebelled? Is it possible that once created immortal, always immortal?
He created us with the ability to perish (Jn 3:16, 2Thes 2:10, 2Pt 2:12, Rev 21:1; 20:14-15) and it is only by and through His Son that we can come into eternity as immortal beings (Heb 9:27-28). We know He did not create His Holy Angels to perish but He did us, so why? If man were to rebel as some of the immortal spirits did then man could be destoryed to protect Heaven -- when you read Rev 12:12 you will see the rebel angels cause grief in Heaven and so were cast to Earth, and then the angels in Heaven "rejoiced" -- why? Because Satan and his rebel angels were cast out of Heaven. Are we getting the picture now? It seems we humans have one thing in common with the Angel spirits, we have freedom of choice, we are not robots and we are both, Angels of God and men of God, called servants – Rev 19:10
A certain number of angels rebelled against their Creator, led by another angelic being, made originally, perfect (Ezek 28:12-13) – until iniquity was found in him (Satan) and he led others in this rebellion – Rev 12: 7-9. This rebellion of immortal spirits may explain why we humans were created as flesh, made up of the physical elements instead of spirit, unlike the angels, so that the wicked, or rebellious of mankind might be destroyed for good -- immortality offered only to those having choosen the way to life, having already demostrated their acceptance of YaHshua as the door to eternity and a desire to remain true to Him and our Heavenly Father.
If immortal then some of us we would, like the rebel angels, suffer forever for our rebellion, in an eternal torment and separation from our Creator, but in our Creator's great mercy He has worked out a way to avoid this. Our immortality hinges on someone He sent to us to show us the way, to make it possible for us to inherit immortality, by accepting Him we are accepted in His righteousness to save us – by choice we chose His way, His Savior, proving ourselves before being granted immortality by our Heavenly Father. We have a choice and while it seem almost unthinkable anyone would turn down the chance for immortality, as a choice, we must remember -- a third of the Angels of Heaven did just that, they sealed their fate by rejecting their Creator and if there is a number among the Angels of Heaven that can or did do this then how much more lowly man?
It is this freedom of choice that is the “fly in the ointment” -- but -- a necessary fly. He could create beings to worship Him as if on autopilot, and He has, actually – Rev 4:7-8 – but this like truning your car radio on, it has not choice but to play the station you want. He could have done that with us but then what would have been the advantage, or the point? He already has creatures created that do what they were created to do without question. Our Father is filled with so much love for His creation He wants to share it and have it returned. Who doesn't want to be loved and to love?
True love, however, comes from those choosing to love you, not because they have to but because they want to. Apparently many of the Angels did not feel this way, so how can you tell, how would God tell? The rebellion told Him a lot and revealed those not deserving of His gift to them -- life. The flaw discovered in the Angels led to a life of rebellion and discord. Read Revelation 12 again and you will see that even though the evil spirits, once Angelic subjects of their Creator, have not been destroyed but cast to earth. If these beings were not created immortal then why not just destroy these rebels -- as He did the first humans? We, on the other hand, have many different threats of destruction, death, dying of natural or unnatural causes, and eternal destruction by fire --
We are told that when YaHshua returns we will be like Him and it is then that we will know what we were born to be. YaHshua is the first fruit, the first of many, and of those coming to Him will be as He is and like Him as brothers and sisters in new form, our birth from the flesh to the same Spirit body He has.
(1Jn 3:2) Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it does not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when He shall appear, we shall be like Him; for we shall see Him as He is./9
(Rom 8:11) And if the Spirit of Him who raised YaHshua from the dead is living in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you.
It is difficult for many to think of our Creator as being mean or angry for it is more pleasant to think of Him as only loving and merciful, which He is, His love for us is greater than we can imagine. But our Heavenly Father and our Savior can get angry and their anger is a righteous anger, a just anger and the wicked, whether of the Spirit, like Satan and his angels, or of the flesh He will have a solution that will save us but not them. The wicked of the flesh were made to perish while the Spirit was made to be eternal. If this were not so then why would He have bothered to make us perishable, why not just make us eternal spirits from the beginning? If He had done that then people like Hitler and Stalin and other mass murderers would have the same gift and we would then be in the same predicament as the Spirit world found itself when Satan and his angels rebelled. It would be a cruel god that would continue to create beings to live in a Hell Fire for eternity being tormented forever, that would be cruel. This, as it appears to me, is why we are in the flesh, so those of us that cannot or will not abide by the Rule of YaHshua will not suffer the eternal life without contact with Him. You might look at this as a proving ground for those passing from death to everlasting life.
One of the reason for a great rebellion by humans would be the anger they will express as they shout how unfair our Creator is. From a human point of view, when the prophetic words of Revelation come true and the wrath of the Lamb and of our Heavenly Father is unleashed there will be those in rebellion against such and unfair and mean and cruel God, as they see it. However, the ultimate answer to HIS plan and for the reason we are in a degenerating and perishable form will be fully explained and seen. Read Rev 6:12-17 and you will see the Wrath of the Lamb and that is only the beginning. Later we read of the Wrath of the Father --
(Rev 14:10) The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of His indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
A time of reckoning is coming --
(Rev 14:19) And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.
(Rev 15:1) And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvelous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God.
It is not pleasant to think about but that changes nothing. His plan is to rid the coming New Heavens and New Earth all all evil and to make sure the evil spirits will have not say or influence in the New Creation that is coming, which we have been invited to come into. Imagine a New Earth with no ocean, no sea? We can't, or at least I have trouble seeing that and for good reason, this is the only Earth or dwelling we have ever known. Being neither male nor female, that too is hard for me to see or envision but that is what we are told, when we are Quickened and receive or are born, literally, into eternal Spirit we will not be identified as males or females but we will be like HIM and we will be Children of the Heavenly Father, like He is. I know, the world teaches a much nicer way into the Kingdom, by side stepping all of the prophetic word and going immediately to Heaven -- and the wicked going immediately to Hell to be tormented day and night by the demons of Satan. If we can see past this idea of no one ever dying, of living forever even if a person is a hater and a murderer and refuses the path presented by our Savior then we can get a glimpse into a new world and universe with no evil.
One of my wife's sisters once told me she would not have a god like that, one so mean as to wipe out a whole group of people just because they were evil. I had no answer for that. She is a dedicated Catholic and It is okay, I guess for people to go to Hell and be tormented and tortured -- that was okay in her eyes but when God told Israel to destroy the people of Canaan, in her eyes that made our Creator God evil and she would have none of it, even though it was in the Bible as a matter of record, as a warning to all. Sodom and Gomorrah had gone so far away from righteous living they had hit the point of no return and He, our Creator, took care of them personally. YaHshua has opened a way for us that when the time of cleansing comes and the real baptism by Fire comes we will survive and enter into the New Heavens, the New Universe as His children.
If you get a chance you might read a brief outline I put together concerning coming events and the special protection He has for us that carry His Name. It may help in seeing why evil cannot be allowed to continue or exist.
I know this can be a bit overwhelming, we have live in this world and be living under the world view and the misdirection of comfortable religions of all sorts. The vast majority of people that have ever lived are most definitely going to get their ticket into the Kingdom. Only the truly evil and misfits would deny YaHshua when it comes to the face to face White Throne judgment -- and He knows the heart and mind of everyone and so the liars will not be able to talk their way in they will truly have to come with a repentant heart and when their eyes are opened I just cannot image anyone refusing this offer -- but, then, Satan was originally created prefect in all his ways and he chose a different path and if a perfect angel can fall by his own choice then how much more men? If our Creator did it any other way then we would just be robots but robots do not return their maker with true love and appreciation.
Thanks, again, Barbara for the opportunity to share and I think this will become an article, why not?
We do not have to see eye to eye on this, not at all, and one day we will all be in agreement, for the most part, when the shadow of what is to come is removed.